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Potential Mold Issue?

 
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D&D



Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:26 pm    Post subject: Potential Mold Issue? Reply with quote

Our condo has a very badly damaged roof which has caused water spots, splits in ceiling drywall, and ceiling leaks in various places including around window sills. The leaking in some places had gone on for an entire month. We even had water coming thru some of our light sockets for a brief time (which we didnít know about until after the fact). Our Association's Board and Management Company are not concerned with mold though we have brought to their attention our suspicions. The leaking started early in December and the roof still has not been fixed (they put a tarp over the area of concern). We're told that the entire roof needs to be removed/replaced and insulation removed/replaced before they can do any inside repairs. We do not see visible mold on the surface however can't it still be present in our environment even if we don't see it? Could it be possible for the roof leaking (or water getting behind shingles and siding) to have gone into the building behind our walls and maybe even get into/under the floor boards? Can we be effected by this mold if it is there but not visible? The rip in our living room ceiling is a lot more opened up now and when shining a flashlight into the hole there is black looking spots up there. Water was dripping thru the insulation into our living room for a month. My husband stuck his finger up in that hole and he feels that it is still damp up there. We have had wet insulation above our ceiling for over 3 months...

We have been experiencing various symptoms affiliated with mold poisoning for a while now, though we haven't been to see a doctor. We have just been thinking flu, allergies, colds, etc. I am also developing respiratory problems (it's starting to hurt to breath deeply and I get winded very easily), wake up nauseous every day with a headache and diarrhea and pounding headache and stuffed up nose. Weíre having issues with memory and concentration and are agitated very easily. We are also itchy and have random spots that look like a cross between a mole and freckle or a spot in a rash. The bumps are red and some are scratchy on the surface like a healing scab, some flat. There are not a lot in any one place... more random in different areas. Some of them are sticking out and sort of swollen like a wart combined with a pimple. I have a dr appt next Friday and would like to know what all she should be testing me for.

Iím afraid weíll need to move into an extended stay motel if things get worse (or our health gets worse). Is our furniture and clothes being effected if there are mold spores in the air? When we move will we have to leave everything behind? Does our dog need a special type of bath once we vacate? She has been for a full check-up recently and thankfully they told us she was in excellent health.

I know I asked a lot of questions and any helpful advice we can get would be greatly appreciated.


Last edited by D&D on Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:22 pm; edited 2 times in total
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D&D



Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UPDATE... just received the results from the indoor air tests.

It shows Penicillium in the bedroom (5 Raw CT, which is listed as low on the analysis). Could even a count this low be effecting my health? Is it probable that the count will go up over time?

And in the living room (where the leak was going on for a month) they found Aspergillus with a count listed as TNTC.

It is most likely that the roof leak and all the moisture that was in the wet insulation above our ceilings caused these molds, or do these types of molds come from a different source? How likely could it be that the rest of our building is effected or will become effected if not addressed in a timely manner? (at least 2 other residents in my building are noticing a funky smell and are recently experiencing some health issues). We live in an 8-unit condo with 4 residences per floor.

Please any assistance would be most appreciated. We have a "shady" Board at our condo and I don't want them to try to spin this around saying that it was something we were doing in our unit that caused the mold so it's best that we can determine if the source of the mold was caused by the roof leak.
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D&D



Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another update...

We are in an extended stay motel now but still got the rashes and donít have the dr report yet.

Last week we had a professional come out to test the air in the attic. He was able to get the trap door to the attic (which is padlocked shut) lifted enough to do an air test, but he wasnít able to actually go into the attic to inspect (so we still have no idea how much mold is up there (above our ceiling).

Hereís the results we got:

Mold CFUs: 31
Oth. CFUs: 8
CFUs/cu m: 1365

Penicillium corylophilum
Sterile hyphae~90%
White Bacterium
Yellow Bacterium

The lab comments are as follows:
The viable spore counts is 2-3 times the level generally considered acceptable for indoor air. Since 90% of the colonies on the plate were sterile, we can make no easy assessment of the risk that this modest infestation may pose. Sterile colonies often arise from basidiospores produced by mushroom relatives. But this is merely a possibility, not a certainty.

My questions I hope someone can help me with:
If there is a great amount of mold in/under the insulation, would that show in the air test, or would the results from the air test be more for the mold that is visible in the attic, like on the wooded areas?

Iím confused by these new results considering the previous test showed the living room air was loaded with Aspergillus. A pipe in the floor above the entrance to the upstairs had busted a few times recently and it took them a long time to patch up the pipe so water was flowing out of the light socket all over the bottom landing. I wonder where all that water went, that didn't come out of the light socket... perhaps under our floor and into the bottoms of the walls? You can really notice the smell difference when you walk in and the air just doesn't feel quite right (I have a harder time breathing in there). Would it be paranoid for me to think that maybe we also have mold inside/behind our walls and under/in the floor/carpet? Should we have the guy come back and get air in the living room retested (he only did an air test in the attic)? Is it possible for there to be mold from another source all over our unit and that same mold not be in the attic? Any opinion on this would be much appreciated.

PS: how do you decontaminate papers? A pile of work papers that had been at the condo for a while due to working from home are now with me at the office and I canít stop coughing while going thru these papers. And when we moved to the motel and I did all the laundry, I broke out in rashes all over the place (I would assume this is from handling the contaminated clothes? They were hanging in the closets and in our dressers). Could our clothes still be contaminated even after washing them with laundry soap and borax? Our room smelled for a couple days (like the condo) just from sorting the laundry in the room prior to washing. I guess we contaminated our hotel room because of this? Also, is everything in our condo that is made of paper or cloth unsafe to bring out of the condo to the hotel? What do we do about all of our financial documents that are all over the condo in (unsealed) shoe boxes?
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Moldpro



Joined: 12 Mar 2003
Posts: 791
Location: San Diego, CA

PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TNTC means TOO NUMEROUS TO COUNT. I am thinking that means..... a lot! 5 is low and not a concern.

Your description of events certainly means that mold would be suspected in the attic area for sure. Insulation merely hold the water in contact with the drywall even longer and allow more mold to grow.

I am glad you have a testing company involved. You may be needing a lawyer. Sounds like your project will be pretty large, but perhaps not too expensive since it sounds like only drywall will be involved,, ( not cabinets and countertops)
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D&D



Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got the test results back from my dr (General Practice) and she said everything came back normal. She checked my blood for Aspergillus Fumigatus, Aspergillus Flavus, and Aspergillus Niger. She suggested I see an allergist.

The mold expert report shows Penicillium in the attic. Is there a way to test for Penicillium exposure? How is blood checked for mycotoxins and are there different types of tests to check for different types of mold exposures?

The previous mold test (air) we did showed Aspergillus sp (TNTC) in our living room. Is there a different test for this variety (what does the sp mean)?

What specifically should I be getting checked? Even the chest X-Ray came back fine, yet I have a burning from my throat all the way down into my chest (and it's not heartburn but a similar type of pain).

Other than documenting photos of our rashes, I don't know what else we can do to prove that staying in the condo is effecting our health.
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Toxic



Joined: 31 Jul 2001
Posts: 1011
Location: United States

PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there anyway you can find another place to stay?

Cheers,
Susan
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D&D



Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Susan, I know there's a lot on my post to read so you may have missed it... We moved to an extended stay motel over the weekend. I'm concerned about our health (and our belongings still in the condo) and have numerous other questions throughout my original post and the 2 updates I added. Any help you can provide with my questions will be much appreciated. Thanx much.
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Dee



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 45
Location: NH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D&D: A regualr physician will not understand your condition. With a very high mycotoxin level ALL my blood work came back NORMAL. Send an email to Dr. WM Croft at doccroft@hotmail.com and he can test your urine for mycotoxins. You need to send him a liter of urine and fed-ex it to him overnight. He will give you the information when you email. Good luck-
I moved out of my home and brought NOTHING from my home with me because the level was so high. That is what Dr. Croft suggested to me. Hope this helps. Dee
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D&D



Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dee, thanks for that info. Makes me feel better to know that I'm not crazy, even if the dr report shows that I am healthy (though she did see all my rashes).

How much mold do you need to have to determine if bringing your belongings is safe? Could we have brought mold spores into the hotel and will we keep getting sick? Also I worry about our furniture as the air in the condo is much worse now.


Last edited by D&D on Sat Apr 28, 2007 12:56 am; edited 2 times in total
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Dee



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 45
Location: NH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You WILL contaminate your new place with your belongings. Dr. Croft will tell you to bring only items that are NOT porous, metal, glass, ceramic etc. I left ALL clothing behind and bought new clothing after I left. If you react to your things (as you said you did with papers) they ARE contaminated for sure. I moved three times into three different locations until I figured out what I was doing wrong. Dr. Croft will tell you to wash your clothes in ammonia which kills mycotoxins. 2 cups of ammonia to each load, this he came up with after I had left my clothes behind. You will not react to the ammonia as it disipates quickly. He also does remediation and can help you As far as how much mold you have, it is the mycotoxins that are harming you that the molds put out. He can measure the damage by the urine test. I would do the test asap so you will know what you are dealing with. Good luck Dee
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suggi



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 190

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dee - where is Dr. Croft. I sure need someone like that. I did see a holistic environmental doc who did blood tests for $600 (insurance does not pay) and I have high levels of mycotoxins in my blood but can not detox with cholestramine because it can cause brittle bones and I already have severe osteoporosis. He was then going to give me IV Vit C and minerals 2x/wk for $80 a pop and since I do not have the money after all I paid for the mold remediation and also only have one arm to work with because I had a mastectomy and they can not use that arm. My good arm looks like I am a mold user because they take blood so much for my health problems and I have all scar tissue.

Sooooo.....maybe Dr. Croft could give me a clue as how to detox also. The holistic doc said I am at risk for liver and kidney cancer and should be checked by my PCP regularly. Well, forget that.....she doesn't believe in the mold sickness problem....none of my "real" docs do either so I am stuck. Can't afford the holistic doc and can't get a real MD to listen.

Thanks for letting me vent. By the way, the blood tests were sent to Immunosciences Lab.
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Dee



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 45
Location: NH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suggi: Dr. Croft is in Madison, Wisconsin and is a medical pathologist, not an MD. He mostly does the tricothecene test and remedition on the home.

Dee
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wiedb



Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

L-Cysteine helps the body to rid mycotoxins. My husband had kidney cancer from the mycotoxins (Dr. Croft found the mycotoxins in the kidney tumor) and he started on 1000 mg of L-Cysteine in the am and 1000mg in the pm. We were much more aggressive with detoxing for him that me as he had the cancer. His levels are very, very low after a year of this. Mine are still high.
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D&D



Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:46 pm    Post subject: New Update On Our Situation Reply with quote

Our new property manager is trying to tell us that Penicillium is not harmful (that's what the mold testing company told the Board President) because it occurs naturally in nature. They don't seem to care about all of the health issues we were having prior to relocating to the motel (and seem to think that we didn't need to move). It doesn't appear that they are going to use an industrial hygienist to clean up the mold (we still think the Board President is just spraying bleach in the attic), because they are already replacing the roof section by section. We are under the impression that they do not plan to remove/replace the insulation from the attic, even though it had been sitting up there wet for several months. They claim that there was surface mold on the woodwork in the attic and it didn't penetrate. (Well then why did our air tests come back positive for mold?) We don't think anyone actually looked under the insulation (or they would have seen the mold that we see in there when we look at it thru the hole in our ceiling). The air in our condo is so bad now that when Servpro came out to examine our contents to determine what could be salvageable, they were wearing those breathing masks. What do we do to ensure that the condo Board and management company doesn't take any shortcuts and the mold is properly cleaned up?
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GoTimothy2



Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 187
Location: MI

PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 2:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All molds are harmful.

You have to see a Occupational Environmental Toxicologist any other doctor is a wast of time and money and could be dangerous to your health.
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suggi



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 190

PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GoTimothy2

Wish I could find one of those Environmental guys.....any that I found said they only work with corporations and not individuals. In other words if the mold is not in your work environment and in your home they will have nothing to do with you -- anyway that is the way it is in Massachusetts. Unreal, right?
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GoTimothy2



Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 187
Location: MI

PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suggi , ask your family doctor for a referral to see a toxicologist. If he will not refer you find another family doctor.
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suggi



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 190

PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey GoTimothy2 -- I missed you...haven't seen you on the board lately and you always have good advice.

As far as finding aother doc is concerned -- all the halfway decent ones are not taking new patients - I did try to see another one but she thought I needed a shrink because I was concerned about the mycotoxins in my blood. So, anyway I am glad you have a good doc.
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GoTimothy2



Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 187
Location: MI

PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suggi, unfortunatly the mold does affect the brain and that is why we are having a hard time proving mold is toxic. The mold is making us mental.

LSD is a mold invented to expand the mind. LSD is made from ERGOT mold. In salem, they tried people who were exposed to ergot, as Witches because the mold made them so crazy.
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suggi



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 190

PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Timothy

I guess that answers the question about my mental health. My mind seems to be gone if you know what I mean. I am also dragging terribly but of course no one cares including the doctors. Everyone just thinks I am making a mountain out of a mole hill so to speak.

We had the house power washed and painted because all the paint was peeling off. The painter discovered the garage window is badly rotten. Unfortunately it is right under the bedroom window where we have been smelling musty on and off for quite some time and could not figure out where it was coming from. When we had the remediators here I had them tear off the bedroom window casing but the little they found they said would not have given off an odor. The odor was still there. I just hope it has not gotten into the space between the garage ceiling and the bedroom and computer room floors as the top of the garage window frame is right on the ceiling. However, when hubby starts the snowblower in the garage I can smell it up in the bedroom and computer room so I am hoping we are smelling it just from that window and can semi-easily be taken care of. Think it may be more job than a carpenter but the remediator costs too much. However, they would fog the garage when they finished. Carpenter surely would not do that. I am sure the spores will be all over once the window is disturbed. Probably are in there now and I am trying to ignore that at present.

We have a crow problem - we are the "fly by route" all of a sudden and all I do every day is clean up feces - on the house, patio, driveway, car. Can just imagine what is in the grass and the grandkids are probably bringing it in on their shoes as well as myself, walking around cleaning off the house. Can't deal with much more. I am going to be 70 years old.

Hope things are better with you.
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TOXIC MOLD

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The most comprehensive mold website with complete information on toxic mold (stachybotrys, penicillium, aspergillus, fusarium, chaetomium, and cladosporium) . Images, physicians list, symptoms, medical updates, descriptions, discussion board, and several other topics.